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Outerra Tech Demo download. Help with graphics driver issues

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Author Topic: more texture variations  (Read 83947 times)

Midviki

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #45 on: March 31, 2013, 01:17:28 pm »

Kelvinr... you are a god.  :P

The only thing that Cameni would need to tweak, or leave it on the player to be able to tweak it, is the way that the geometry of the rocks is stretching.It is showing the 'hack' off. :)

For example you can see the stretching that I marked on one of the screenshots.And this is my own opinion of what may be improved :

*And beware this is just a design point of view to the naked eye.*

[Legend]:

- Black = perfect ( good ^ )

- White = acceptable ( decent ^ )

- Dark Red = bothering to the eye ( pour ^ )

Have a look:




Hope you appreciate the feedback.It is not easy for me criticizing your awesome and beloved engine (I know it feels like having, rooting... and the protective maternal instincts that you would have as on your own child ).  ;D :P
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ZeosPantera

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #46 on: March 31, 2013, 02:01:41 pm »

I think this has a load to do with terrain not self-shadowing.. Once that is fixed this scene will look MUCH different.
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cameni

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #47 on: March 31, 2013, 02:17:22 pm »

Hmm, I can't say I see a clear distinction between the good and bad from that screenshot, but that doesn't mean I don't know about the issues :)
There are places where the displacement creates some kind of narrow slivers (or how to put it in English). It's usually on the edges of tiles for some reason, definitely a bug in the continuity of the horizontal displacement equation.

Anyway, at this time the displacement is purely fractal, and that generates always a same-looking pattern. Rocks will be using another mask generating shapes characteristic for different rock types. Therefore the displacement effect will change, hence I'm not bothering with this now.
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Midviki

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #48 on: March 31, 2013, 03:57:06 pm »

This sounds like great / amazing 'news'.

But speaking of this 'different rock types', have you thought of investing time just for a few 'nailed to the wall' textures ( like how many can Kelvinr may be able to create, as he wishes ) and unchangeable texture / geometry.And for the rest you can let the user work for them? ( I meant that a few textures should be in order from the engine itself like an example or the samples that Kelvinr is creating.. but a more wide diversity of textures should be created by the user)

I mean... I would love to have the power in my hands to manipulate the shape of the geometry and texture.Like being able to introduce my own set of 3D vector coordinates to change the parameters of the algorithms that you created, and introduce my own photo-shop made textures on top of that geometry.And not needing to hack the files, and probably breaching some kind of legal right from the contract agreement, and instead have a interface for this kind of 'freedom'.

And to give you an example..

For example lets say we have a beach with sand.As you see it... the beach is empty.But you can apply and "invisible road" ( like the current road, but with no texture in it, but instead you will have pre-made objects ), and on that 'invisible road' you can add objects made from 3D coordinates or import a model of a small rock or multiple rocks that you want to mix, because you want on that area to be populated only with that kind of object.And you can set parameters like how many rocks(or pebbles) of that type you want to have per square meter.And those rocks would be converted from the 3D geometry of the model you have imported or the handmade coordinates of the geometry that you applied to the script.And other parameters like the height where the rocks should be placed, the density per square meter / feet of their nature.

You could even place this in the air, like some floating rocks, or asteroid belt ( but there I guess it will be another method, but lets stick 'small' ).Anyway the 'rocks' or material that you apply would be attached in to the geometry and texture like a road, on top of the original terrain.Like if you want to remove 1 rock or dig with a shovel you will hit the original sand texture from underneath, and place the entire geometry of the 'rock' that you shoved out from that spot with the shovel someplace, somewhere near.

Or even remove it for good from the plain of the 'wave' that is embedded in to the original texture ( like the current roads ) trough the 'wave plain'.And put it in your truck and use it for building stuff or making something with them, like a 'natural' dam on a river or before a waterfall or something.And the 'plain' it would be like a 'wave' type 'road' appliance as I said similar to the current road appliance.Only that the 'terrain' geometry from it could be modified not only when in the engine in the 'edit mode', but more likely when stepping with a large truck on those beach rocks they will go deep inside the sand because of the weight of the truck passing over them, and leaving a trail as in reality.

And you could do the same with the current geometry / texture appliances of the roads we have now.Or for example the gravel road to transform it, so that each pebble would have its own thing going on when you pass with a car / truck over it.Plus the movement of the geometry when stepping on them or something like that could have a sound, like in reality.The friction from the 'wave'-like movement when forces applied.Or those 'objects' can be trees rooted in the ground, that you make in some 3D modeling software.. and you can struck them down to the ground with your truck or car, and cut them in to pieces, load them in your vehicle and etc.. ( but this may be a bit off from the 'simple' idea that I started in the beginning of this reply ).


Hope you like the idea if you haven't thought of it yet.And maybe one of the multiple things I said here becomes reality.
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cameni

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #49 on: April 01, 2013, 05:13:08 am »

If I understand you right, you basically described how the vector overlay is going to work by altering the terrain materials and other terrain parameters. Well except the insanity of "every pebble" being simulated when a car goes over it. I guess doing the math of how many pebbles there are would cure it ;)

Besides, you mainly need to push down the dirt. While the simulation of individual dirt particles not viable, the tech used for the craters can be used for imprinting the tire trails, both in the texture and geometry. Generally, OT tries to match the outcome, not to simulate it, because the latter is considerably more computationally expensive.
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Sam

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #50 on: April 01, 2013, 05:57:56 am »

For example lets say we have a beach with sand.As you see it... the beach is empty.But you can apply and "invisible road" ( like the current road, but with no texture in it, but instead you will have pre-made objects ), and on that 'invisible road' you can add objects made from 3D coordinates or import a model of a small rock or multiple rocks that you want to mix, because you want on that area to be populated only with that kind of object.And you can set parameters like how many rocks(or pebbles) of that type you want to have per square meter.And those rocks would be converted from the 3D geometry of the model you have imported or the handmade coordinates of the geometry that you applied to the script.And other parameters like the height where the rocks should be placed, the density per square meter / feet of their nature.
That's a real good idea.  ;) So you can build the world much more different.
Once more the example rocks. The rocks from Hawaii looks much different than the Rocks from the Alpes for example. So I think, it's not so easy to find a way to build different rocks (and landscapes as well  ??? )
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Midviki

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #51 on: April 01, 2013, 12:12:32 pm »

That's a real good idea.  ;) So you can build the world much more different.
Once more the example rocks. The rocks from Hawaii looks much different than the Rocks from the Alpes for example. So I think, it's not so easy to find a way to build different rocks (and landscapes as well  ??? )

Another thing would be... a 3D model with rocks made by you.. and each rock would be a different editable mesh / poly .. and if you do a script for the imported object.If the rocks are stuck in to the ground, the terrain around them would be around them and the object would not go trough the ground.Like a small crater under the rock, the original terrain would not touch the model, but it will act like a glove, sticking at a few millimeters from the object.And the script will make the objects be individual, so if in a sheet of 20 rocks you remove one... you can take that one home. :)
« Last Edit: April 01, 2013, 12:17:22 pm by Midviki »
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KelvinNZ

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #52 on: April 02, 2013, 04:27:07 am »

Basalt rock texture sample




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PytonPago

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #53 on: April 02, 2013, 06:03:28 am »

Basalt rock texture sample

Looking good ..
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Ozybolairy

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #54 on: April 02, 2013, 06:36:47 am »

Hi Kelvinr,

you may or may not be the one to answer this question, but are the rock models the same throughout the engine despite the texture, e.g. this video shows basalt rock, but what would the model look like if it were slate or chalk?

is there a plan to produce a landslide type texture as all mountains would have this to some degree?

keep up the excellent work. I can't wait to seen all these applied to Outerra at the same time so each rock formation in each continent looks slightly different!
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cameni

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #55 on: April 02, 2013, 07:21:12 am »

The way the rocks are procedurally created currently is purely fractal driven, and that generates always a same-looking pattern. We will be using another displacement texture generating shapes characteristic for different rock types.
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ZeosPantera

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #56 on: April 02, 2013, 01:06:34 pm »

That look amazing.
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Timmo

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #57 on: April 02, 2013, 06:21:24 pm »

The way the rocks are procedurally created currently is purely fractal driven, and that generates always a same-looking pattern. We will be using another displacement texture generating shapes characteristic for different rock types.

Ahh the beauty of using fractals :)

Will the variables in the fractal equations used to create the different fractal 'noise' for each land/biome type be exposed to the user? This could be another way the community could mod the assets of the engine by coming up with new biomes (which themselves would be a combination of fractal parameters, textures and related data which places them geographically)
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KelvinNZ

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #58 on: April 03, 2013, 05:23:00 am »

Not sure Timmo, this would be a question Brano could answer better than me. All I can say is that shape files will be used as another layer on the rocks to create each different rock formation.

K.
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Edding3000

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Re: more texture variations
« Reply #59 on: April 03, 2013, 07:27:20 am »

The way the rocks are procedurally created currently is purely fractal driven, and that generates always a same-looking pattern. We will be using another displacement texture generating shapes characteristic for different rock types.

Ahh the beauty of using fractals :)

Will the variables in the fractal equations used to create the different fractal 'noise' for each land/biome type be exposed to the user? This could be another way the community could mod the assets of the engine by coming up with new biomes (which themselves would be a combination of fractal parameters, textures and related data which places them geographically)
It might be a very interesting add-on to make the variables/parameters available in an ini file for the user to adjust/tweak.
Shouldnt be a real big deal if you ask me. The only thing is that when they cannot hard code the variables in the shaders, but will have to set them in c++.
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