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Author Topic: [WIP] Boeing 727-200 - Updates in OP  (Read 42214 times)

alialiali

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[WIP] Boeing 727-200 - Updates in OP
« on: June 09, 2014, 09:26:55 pm »

Changing Software

Hello all!
I know it's been very quiet on the development and update front but I can assure you the project has not been abandoned!
The main thing at the present time that's slowing down progress is the switch from Blender 3D to Autodesk 3DS Max/Maya.

As I've started back at university, the software focus is on Maya for commercial production rather than Blender, which isn't really a serious contender in the serious film and animated movie industry. Because of this, I feel that I should try and phase out my use of Blender in order to allow my brain to adjust to the new controls and interface.

There has been a little progress on the cockpit front:


I hope to get back to you all with some more updates soon.

Ali

--OP--

Hello everyone!

I've been with this engine a long time now and have been waiting since day 1 for a nice passenger jet to explore the world. Well rather than wait, I thought I'd just go for it.
I'm a student currently studying 3D Computer Visualization and Animation so I hope I can bring my skills in the 3D industry to Outerra and bring you guys some good content.

What I do need though is a little help with the coding side of things. I'm not the best when it comes to that part!



Lets bring jets to Outerra shall we?

Ali
« Last Edit: October 10, 2014, 01:14:22 pm by alialiali »
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Jagerbomber

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2014, 12:01:26 am »

Hehe, You know there's a runway tab?  :P
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John514

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2014, 02:29:39 am »

I`m glad that you`re doing this. Keep it up.
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You mustn't be afraid to dream a little bigger, darling

Note: I do not claim to know everything.
I just like to help people around the forum.

alialiali

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2014, 05:33:28 am »

Hehe, You know there's a runway tab?  :P

Yes, I do but I prefer my runways to slightly conform to the terrain, like real ones do. I used the runway tab then edited the heights slightly to make it a little more realistic.
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alialiali

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2014, 06:59:13 am »

I need some help.

The aircraft is currently using the c172.js and the c172r model.

I'm having this issue:



My blender setup:



Any clues as to why it's floating?
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PytonPago

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  • It´s way too complex, dont let me try to explain !
Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2014, 02:12:12 pm »

If the wheels are defined, it falls to their position, otherwise, it could be a bad pivot-point placement (sometimes blender doesn't use those you see, but the original, that was pushed around - you can try resetting them for all the parts) ...
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John514

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2014, 02:14:12 pm »

Jest a modelling tip: Select your whole model and apply an edge split modifier. It sould fix they way the engines look.
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Levi

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2014, 02:54:21 pm »

I'm very bad explaining things, but I will try it anyways :D

First of all, set your Main pivot point where you think the CG (Center of Gravity) of your airplane is. Then open "c172r.xml" and edit the following code:

        <location name="CG" unit="IN">   <--- You also can use [unit="M"] to use meters instead of IN(inches)
            <x> 39 </x>
            <y> 0 </y>
            <z> 36.5 </z>
        </location>

Set X,Y,Z to "0", so the CG will be where your Main pivot is. (If I remember well, I had a problem here with X axis, so I set it to 1.0 [<x> 1.0 </x>]).

I also used to set all X, Y, X of <location name="VRP" unit="IN"> and <location name="EYEPOINT" unit="IN"> to 0.0

Then you scroll down and under <ground_reactions> and you have:

        <contact type="BOGEY" name="NOSE">
            <location unit="IN">
                <x> -6.8 </x>
                <y> 0 </y>
                <z> -18 </z>
            </location>
            <static_friction> 0.8 </static_friction>
            <dynamic_friction> 0.5 </dynamic_friction>
            <rolling_friction> 0.02 </rolling_friction>
            <spring_coeff unit="LBS/FT"> 3800 </spring_coeff>
            <damping_coeff unit="LBS/FT/SEC"> 400 </damping_coeff>
            <max_steer unit="DEG"> 10 </max_steer>
            <brake_group> NONE </brake_group>
            <retractable>0</retractable>      <------ Set this to 1 if your landing gear is Retractable.
        </contact>

This is the NOSE wheel (you can add many wheels you want, by duplicating the <contact> section renaming each under name="NOSE" and obviously write the correct coordinates).
You have to write the coordinates of each wheel under X, Y, Z. Note: The coordinates are exactly the same as in 3ds Max, except  In Max,  Y Negative == X Positive in FDM   I think in Blender in the same, if not, use trial and error, that always works ;)

Note: All coordinates are relative to the Main Pivot point.

I hope you understand my poor explanation :D


« Last Edit: June 10, 2014, 02:56:33 pm by Levi »
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alialiali

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2014, 07:45:00 pm »

Jest a modelling tip: Select your whole model and apply an edge split modifier. It sould fix they way the engines look.
The model is more of a placeholder than anything at the moment. Don't worry, I've got plenty years experience in modeling that should give a good final design.

Alright, I fixed the floating issue (Thanks Levi), but it seems to have caused another which is that as soon as it starts moving, it skids off to the left uncontrollably. The nose wheel steering seems to have no effect. Any ideas?

I'm using a script generated by the Aeromatic for JBSim and I think it's putting my CG miles off and therefore when I make it 0, the dynamics of the aircraft completely mess up.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 09:04:26 pm by alialiali »
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alialiali

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2014, 10:03:33 pm »

I've literally got no idea whats going on with the contact points and getting this thing working. Here's the Blend file and the OTX, some help would be greatly appreciated.

OTX: https://www.dropbox.com/s/03li0dg2wpxyldg/jet.Ali.otx
Blend: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ganizqosk0d9hh1/jet2.blend
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John514

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2014, 05:31:08 am »

Jest a modelling tip: Select your whole model and apply an edge split modifier. It sould fix they way the engines look.
Don't worry, I've got plenty years experience in modeling that should give a good final design.

Good to hear! On the other hand I have just started learning.
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You mustn't be afraid to dream a little bigger, darling

Note: I do not claim to know everything.
I just like to help people around the forum.

Levi

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2014, 06:53:19 am »

I've literally got no idea whats going on with the contact points and getting this thing working. Here's the Blend file and the OTX, some help would be greatly appreciated.

OTX: https://www.dropbox.com/s/03li0dg2wpxyldg/jet.Ali.otx
Blend: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ganizqosk0d9hh1/jet2.blend
Under <ground_reactions> you have two types of Contact points:

type="BOGEY": These are used to define the contact surface/point of each wheel, the lower part of the wheel. See green helpers:


type="STRUCTURE": These are used to define the collision points of the fuselage (at the moment they collide only with the terrain). See green helpers:



And about the Center of Gravity, I suggest you to find the most realistic place for it, I think it should be somewhere under the wings, but not at the same height as the wheels. Of course you can change it from FDM, but first it's better to have the pivot point where the CG should be. The CG will be affected by the Fuel tanks as well. These are located under <propulsion> and you can add as many as you need. But you have to distribute the total weight somehow because you have Empty Weight, Payload, and each Fuel Tank that will add to the overall weight of your plane.

Your Pivot point:


How it should be (It could be moved a bit backward and/or upward, but I think you have to do a research and figure out where it is on the real thing, and of course the CG will vary with the fuel tanks, if they are not filled proportionally, the CG will be moved even on the sides...):


So... I took a quick look at your airplane, and tweaked some basic things in the FDM so now you can move the aircraft and steer. It can take off, but a bit hard because of the weight's distribution and quantity I think. You have to tweak some values like where are the fuel tanks and how much fuel on each tank, also the position of each turbine, add more collision points, correct the position of the wheels in type="BOGEY", and so on. I think the wheels are sinking a bit, so you have to script the wheels to act in concordance with the suspension, it's not so hard, you also can take a look at the Basler bt67's Script & FDM. Inside the script I added some basic comments so you can understand a bit easier what each part does.

.OTX
.blend

If you still having questions, feel free to ask :)
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alialiali

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2014, 05:46:50 pm »

Thank you very very much for foxing those issues Levi!

I'll take a look at fixing the balance, from what I can tell it just seems to not want to raise the nose on take off, but it is fine once in flight.
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Levi

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2014, 03:54:32 am »

Thank you very very much for foxing those issues Levi!

I'll take a look at fixing the balance, from what I can tell it just seems to not want to raise the nose on take off, but it is fine once in flight.

You're welcome, and glad it helped!

Yes, you'll have to play with the CG and distribute the weight until you find the right balance, it's a matter of trial and error I guess.

For any issue you'll have, don't hesitate to ask :)
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alialiali

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Re: Bringing Jets to Outerra - Boeing 727
« Reply #14 on: June 17, 2014, 06:33:41 pm »

Quick Development Update:

I am currently working on the aircraft balance and getting the nose to lift off the runway. Once the aircraft is in flight, it seems to function as it would and it feels realistic. If anyone has any suggestions as to how the CoG/CoL/ARP relate/would be best placed, it would be appreciated.

Got that sorted. Next comes refining the flight dynamics and then my favorite bit, modeling/animation.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2014, 08:07:02 pm by alialiali »
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