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Outerra Tech Demo download. Help with graphics driver issues

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Author Topic: Next big update  (Read 11573 times)

DenisJ

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2016, 02:08:30 am »


and finally
  • The Game
As you finally defined this in the roadmap, I started to feel uncomfortable, as the game looms in foreseeable future. I think to myself "When it is going to release, my daily watch of the forum, which already have lasted for 4 years, is going to come to end. How am I going to fill this void?..."
Never realised Anterworld would cause existential crisis  :D

Anyway, thank you for taking you time in describing the current path. It's nice to know the direction in which you are going.
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cameni

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #16 on: August 22, 2016, 04:40:12 am »

With 30m imagery we will see man made structures (more obviously). How is this compatible with a "Anteworld"?

The satellite data come with array of infra sensor channels that allow for determining whether given square is an artificial material. Previously I have done some processing with Modis data that removes urban areas by replacing them with randomized surrounding natural data, as if the vegetation overtook the city gradually from outside. From this:



to this:



Since urban areas will be filled with buildings and roads, and in the imagery they come up basically as desert areas currently, we will have to run this algorithm anyway, whether it's to replace the cities altogether or just to get some greenery into cities.

However, all the available satellite data are obviously derived from current epoch; we can't pretend that Anteworld is the world from before 20k years, not without trying to revert all effects of human activity like the massive deforestation to get back to that world state (the pale yellow color is cropland). Rather, the game will almost certainly use the existing world data, only eroded forward into a semi-natural state. It's actually desirable to keep some more or less faint traces of civilization, the extent of which depends on how good we'll be able to make it look - eroding all the roads and overgrowing cities, rendering broken buildings etc.
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Acetone

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #17 on: August 22, 2016, 05:04:44 pm »

Nice!

- new object rendering pipeline allowing easier and more powerful usage by the rest of the engine
Result of the benchmarks tests?

The satellite data come with array of infra sensor channels that allow for determining whether given square is an artificial material.
I was about to ask if these areas could be useful for some improvements in cities, like flattening the terrain, but then I realized this type of information is already in OSM, and probably more simple to handle that way  :)

Some plans in the future for some area shapes for roads vectors ? With the lanes it's now easier to work on some areas, like airport apron, but still complex to get these shapes right, you have to use several roads and with big surfaces getting 100% perfect merging is really hard.
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aWac9

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #18 on: August 22, 2016, 05:18:21 pm »

We expect great things,,, and I will be happy when Cameni cite the word Beta. :)
I share the view of the planet as it is.
It could not be otherwise, the data are of our time. although everything has moved even seguimo moving. Poles fact they end up being reversed,
Every year many airport runways have to be painted close to the numerical indications and orientardas the new magnetic north. He is now in Alaska but we also know that moves at 65 kilometers per year to Russia and thus the auroras. Now the magnetic pole is in Bathurst Island (NW Canada) and geographical pole is in Adelaide (Antarctica). this will simulate time today not yesterday.

forgiveness for google translation

« Last Edit: August 24, 2016, 02:26:57 am by aWac9 »
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HiFlyer

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #19 on: August 22, 2016, 06:05:18 pm »

Looks promising!
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cameni

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #20 on: August 23, 2016, 03:24:21 am »

The satellite data come with array of infra sensor channels that allow for determining whether given square is an artificial material.
I was about to ask if these areas could be useful for some improvements in cities, like flattening the terrain, but then I realized this type of information is already in OSM, and probably more simple to handle that way  :)

OSM contains incomplete info broken into small pieces, I don't think it's usable for terrain flattening as such. But yes, we'll eventually want to use these data to remove buildings baked into the satellite elevation map. That's what produces those hills in Manhattan and in every larger city. Then it can be also used to generally level the terrain or to suppress fractal noise.


Quote
Some plans in the future for some area shapes for roads vectors ? With the lanes it's now easier to work on some areas, like airport apron, but still complex to get these shapes right, you have to use several roads and with big surfaces getting 100% perfect merging is really hard.

I omitted tons of "small" things like a new road editor integrated into the scenery editor, with auto-merging and multi-node editing etc. Spline roads are supposed to handle the most common pavement types, but for anything more complex there will be a polygon based vector overlay.
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Acetone

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #21 on: August 23, 2016, 04:08:53 am »

Cool, thanks a lot  :)
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Player1

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #22 on: August 23, 2016, 06:40:51 am »

Wow, you still have a lot to do. And Outerra is great already. You are doing a good job, cameni and who else is working on this. :D Really can't wait for the final result, it is going to be gorgeous! Wish you good luck with every further enhancement and take your time. :)
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Lewin

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #23 on: August 23, 2016, 08:09:10 am »

Hello!
It can be some details about erosion? Will erosion be applied locally or to the whole territory? Will erosion be applied after the fractal algorithm generating parts
DEM-Fractal-Erosion.
or DEM-Erosion-Fractal?
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cameni

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #24 on: August 24, 2016, 06:55:35 am »

Will erosion be applied after the fractal algorithm generating parts DEM-Fractal-Erosion or DEM-Erosion-Fractal?

It would have to be DEM-Erosion-Fractal, but the erosion may also be a part of the fractal process. If you are referring to this:
Quote
  • incorporating lithology (surface rock) data, support for different erosion patterns
That's about applying various erosion patterns to rock types, not trying to simulate erosion on them.
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Lewin

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #25 on: August 24, 2016, 09:19:56 am »


Quote
That's about applying various erosion patterns to rock types, not trying to simulate erosion on them.

Interesting! Can see from the screenshot :)


Quote
not trying to simulate erosion on them.

What's the problem with a true simulation of erosion, it will take a lot of time or the main difficulty in the other?
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cameni

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #26 on: August 24, 2016, 10:59:13 am »

True simulation requires tons of data, not just time. For example, different soils and rocks erode differently, and to simulate it one would actually have to have a more detailed model of the terrain than possible. It would be easier if the whole planet was made of sand or one type of dirt, but it's not (lots of erosion demos work just with that). Means we'd have to get detailed data for rock and soil composition, then also get good enough models for their erosion and then get lots of time to run erosion algorithms to produce good detail.

But we do not need to simulate it to get believable results. What we have got is a map of rock & soil types around the world, and we can get samples of how the erosion looks like on them, and we can (hopefully) devise an algorithm that procedurally generates the desired patterns.

It would be different if we did purely procedural planets, where the large scale erosion pattern isn't given by the elevation data but must be generated. But even there, I lean more towards pattern-matching than to the simulation, because of its efficiency and better compatibility with artistic input. For example, imagine somebody draws a fantasy planet, outlining continent shapes and mountain ranges. You can run erosion simulation to break the mountain range into peaks and to produce the river network, but it requires many passes and the erosion model usually doesn't contain nearly enough information to produce interesting results globally.
Also, artists may want to place major rivers there that suit the world setting, and want the rest of the world be refined automatically. A reverse-erosion algorithm would take these input data, compute river basins and iterate from the river upwards, carving the terrain in the process. Basically saying - if the river goes here, the surrounding terrain must be like this, to be realistic. The reverse process enforces patterns (with procedural alteration) to produce something believable. Doing so it needs a lot less resources and computation passes than the simulation.
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Lewin

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #27 on: August 25, 2016, 07:11:36 am »

Just now, the fractal detail often look alien

Weak erosion (not to river networks) possibly could not take into account the different types of rock, but would make a fractal more natural details, like this



Let's hope that your new erosion algorithm will work even better.
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HiFlyer

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #28 on: August 25, 2016, 08:58:25 am »

After watching Outerra for years, I have the impression that the fractal refinement has a tendency to destroy the type of detail shown in that final picture.
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2eyed

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Re: Next big update
« Reply #29 on: August 25, 2016, 01:00:09 pm »

After watching Outerra for years, I have the impression that the fractal refinement has a tendency to destroy the type of detail shown in that final picture.
Do you mean the kind of crumble mixture we see on (mostly) mountains?
I think the DEM data is still too low in resolution to unveil finer erosion structures.
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