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Author Topic: Outerra Beta Video  (Read 46314 times)

Matt6767

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #15 on: November 05, 2011, 02:35:53 am »

kind of plastic toy... difficult to explain what I mean by that.

I see it.

Great video, loved the mountain scenes the most.
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cameni

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #16 on: November 05, 2011, 03:13:17 am »

Nice Video with lovely well chosen music, some of the scenes were breathtaking (mountain peaks & beach) but the aircraft motion is all wrong, kind of plastic toy... difficult to explain what I mean by that.

Somebody should try. Is it because of the missing turbulence that one would expect in mountains, or what it is?
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petitfilou

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #17 on: November 05, 2011, 03:41:56 am »

Could be my erratic flying trying to juggle the joypad with one hand and the mouse with the other.  :o ;D

I guess without weather system, wind currents, friction, resistance, etc.   the plane flies within an empty shell. 
« Last Edit: November 05, 2011, 06:17:20 am by petitfilou »
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vinny2001

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #18 on: November 05, 2011, 02:18:30 pm »

Hi, Guys!

Very good video of the Outerra Beta!! Looking good!!

           Cheers,
         Vincent
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ZeosPantera

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #19 on: November 05, 2011, 11:25:25 pm »

Nice Video with lovely well chosen music, some of the scenes were breathtaking (mountain peaks & beach) but the aircraft motion is all wrong, kind of plastic toy... difficult to explain what I mean by that.

Somebody should try. Is it because of the missing turbulence that one would expect in mountains, or what it is?

I think it is all just down to the speed of the control surfaces. In real life if you told someone to rock the flaps back and forth to full excursion it would take twice the time it does in-game due to all the real life resistance and control movement required.
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[deleted]

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2011, 06:37:34 am »

The speed is ok. The wind resistance no, like I said in my previous post
« Last Edit: November 06, 2011, 06:39:24 am by secret1962 »
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MacPhisto

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2011, 02:28:46 pm »

I think it's also effected by the camera. Some games have an active camera, meaning it's not fixed but moving with the aircraft but on a damper delay. Hard to explain.
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[deleted]

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #22 on: November 09, 2011, 09:06:06 am »

You mean the g (gravity) effects in the cockpit like in dcs a-10 where you can active them or not in misc menu ? Without it feels realistic anyway, it's not that heavy if outerra hasn't got.
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PytonPago

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #23 on: November 10, 2011, 09:00:40 am »

Nice Video with lovely well chosen music, some of the scenes were breathtaking (mountain peaks & beach) but the aircraft motion is all wrong, kind of plastic toy... difficult to explain what I mean by that.


Somebody should try. Is it because of the missing turbulence that one would expect in mountains, or what it is?

There also aren't the strips of wind. When wings cut wind they make white strips, can you understand ? Just take a look at videos of flight simulator or dcs a-10c and you'll understand. Also, when you go slow and turn too fast, the plane should unbalance. If you need tips contact me, I love flying choppers and jets.

EDIT: example at 2.02 of the video
EDIT2: AT 2.41 the plane should make the water move at that low altidude, because of the wind it moves.

Means the "Joule-Thompson effect" - actually the principle of any gas-cooling system ... when an compressed air flows trough a small space to an enviroment with much lower pressure, the temparature is dropping. By planes, it occurs at edges during hi-maneuvers, when part of the under wings pressured volume of air escapes it from the side or front edges/tips ... its such an temparature drop, that the airhumidity goes back to liquid form making such clowd/fog strips. (Dont be messed with airshows-mostly they use fog-dispenzers to make it graphically nicer trought all the turbuence around the airframe| ...
 
Thats the real one. Notice the little one on the right-wing at the middle of the front-flap too. Normally they are catched at the wingtips, mostly at high altitudes-speeds where the sorounding temparature needs a slightly lower temparature drop to reach the boiling point of water (So at Everest you need a lower temparature to boil water for tee due to lower atmosprere pressure : D| Its also the reason of the interesting look of sound-barier breach, and/orr for problems with freezing of the wings, why the ice is staying at the wings making an problem to the performance of aircraft - can see on airfields sometimes how they dispose of them after landing.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2011, 09:09:38 am by PytonPago »
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Edding3000

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #24 on: November 12, 2011, 06:17:09 am »

At low speeds you do NOT have any strips of condensed water anywhere on the plane.
Furthermore, flaps in big airplanes take long to extend. In the plane i fly flaps 10 is i think 2 to 3 seconds. then to flaps 40 is another 4 seconds. Extension of flaps is fast.
I do not have a joystick around here to test the airplane in outerra. Sad, because i would be able to check if the 'feeling' is allright.

Just watched the video and indeed rolling and yawing of the plane seems to be wrong. Can it be that in rolling of the airplane it is not taken into account that lift decreases? It seems like that. furthermore: Yawing causes rolling and the other way around. It seems like this is also not happening in outerra.
If i roll to the left, i will also generate a yawing motion to the right, even without rudders.
Also: when i apply right rudder it also comes with an right rolling motion.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2011, 06:25:48 am by Edding3000 »
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[deleted]

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #25 on: November 12, 2011, 07:43:22 am »

At low speeds you do NOT have any strips of condensed water anywhere on the plane.
Furthermore, flaps in big airplanes take long to extend. In the plane i fly flaps 10 is i think 2 to 3 seconds. then to flaps 40 is another 4 seconds. Extension of flaps is fast.
I do not have a joystick around here to test the airplane in outerra. Sad, because i would be able to check if the 'feeling' is allright.

Just watched the video and indeed rolling and yawing of the plane seems to be wrong. Can it be that in rolling of the airplane it is not taken into account that lift decreases? It seems like that. furthermore: Yawing causes rolling and the other way around. It seems like this is also not happening in outerra.
If i roll to the left, i will also generate a yawing motion to the right, even without rudders.
Also: when i apply right rudder it also comes with an right rolling motion.
2 things I can tell back:
1) whoever said at low speeds you have strips ?
2) without testing none can tell about the roll, because he didn't show any (important) rolling.
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PytonPago

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #26 on: November 12, 2011, 01:55:44 pm »

Well true, need a really fast plane to hawe some stripps :D And it would be really iteresting to see all the flight-pref., Cameni and co. surelly used some flight data for the cesna, but the engine testing reason was the thing in it, so I would not expect it to be a "sim" already :D ... such a full-clic cockpit in an hi-sidewind landing at an enginefailure will be a muss in Outerra and I sure am willing to wait it up. No reason to hurry and stress them into it. Lets let them measure twice before cutting to not wait for a bunch of fixes because of us   ::) ...
But, back to the video - awesome work to time Outerra Team !  8) The beach fly-by was really imposant, like the look of the shorewater. Just keep up doing this great job of yours, we all holding some thumbs up for you  !  ;)
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We are still undeveloped as long as we don´t realize, that all our science is still descriptive, and than beyond that description lies a whole new world we just haven´t even started to fully understand.

Edding3000

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2011, 05:40:58 pm »

Nice Video with lovely well chosen music, some of the scenes were breathtaking (mountain peaks & beach) but the aircraft motion is all wrong, kind of plastic toy... difficult to explain what I mean by that.

Somebody should try. Is it because of the missing turbulence that one would expect in mountains, or what it is?

There also aren't the strips of wind. When wings cut wind they make white strips, can you understand ? Just take a look at videos of flight simulator or dcs a-10c and you'll understand. Also, when you go slow and turn too fast, the plane should unbalance. If you need tips contact me, I love flying choppers and jets.

EDIT: example at 2.02 of the video
EDIT2: AT 2.41 the plane should make the water move at that low altidude, because of the wind it moves.
You say it here.

If i see the motion in the video's the thing that i see is that the plane moves around it's axis but there seems to be little influence.
For example: if you turn you have to increase your angle of attack to not descend. I dont see that here. Aircraft rolls and maintains speed and altitude, this is impossible.
View from the cockpit is actually kind of good!

And dont start me on a/c theory or how an aircraft should 'feel'. Flight simulator is nothing like the real thing.
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PytonPago

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #28 on: November 13, 2011, 05:33:33 am »

Its just an presentation to a book, still has a buch of problems in math.-terms free to get from the net :
http://www.princeton.edu/~stengel/MAE331Lectures.html
I think, for the debate, the 16, 19, 20 and 23 lectures are the ones to be worth looking at in detail. But all of them are really interesting. ... hope it helps a little.
As for te book : Robert F. Stengel-Aircraft Flight Dynamics
... pilots have a lot of math to do too. Getting it to a intuition level is actually the point of it, so they can fastly assume and correct effects in-flight.
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We are still undeveloped as long as we don´t realize, that all our science is still descriptive, and than beyond that description lies a whole new world we just haven´t even started to fully understand.

cameni

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Re: Outerra Beta Video
« Reply #29 on: November 13, 2011, 05:44:45 am »

Well, whatever the behavior is or should be, it ought to be addressed to JSBSim that does the simulation. Though it's entirely possible that we are using a wrong physics model, or not enabling what we should. In any case, this can get fixed when some JSBSim people get their hands on it.
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