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[lonewulf47]

...I don't think that vehicles with power steering auto-center.

Oh yess, they do, be sure...  I wouldn't know of ANY of my cars used throughout my life (including trucks) that wouldn't "auto-center". Just to make sure: of course it is not an absolutely accurate auto-centering as it is dependend on so many factors like proper suspension geometry, roll-friction, slant, speed etc.

[Maximum Mod]

Couldn't you just make so that you can choose between the sim-steering and some arcady steering where it responds immediately?

[ZeosPantera]

ZeosPantera, Where's the steering wheel and gear shifter? Vehicles with manual steering usually auto-center when you let go of the steering wheel. I don't think that vehicles with power steering auto-center.

Permanently Wood Screwed into my desk and attached to my chair. [/hardcore]

What makes a vehicle auto-center is the physical caster on the suspension components.

Like this

But here

The wheels on all vehicles are setup with a slight tilt between the top and bottom yolk putting either the top or bottom further forward causing the front wheels to drag slightly behind the attachment point. Having both the left and right do this at the same time makes the steering wheel center. Pulling harder as you go faster.

Couldn't you just make so that you can choose between the sim-steering and some arcady steering where it responds immediately?

Yes and no. There just needs to be more options like digital steering rates speed curves like a race sim (rFactor or RichardBurns have very good keyboard options). The overall point however would be to keep keyboarders at a slight disadvantage not having the precision of a full wheel and pedals. If you make the overall physics arcady there will be no advantage to using this platform as a sim.

I'm no flight simmer but I want to learn to fly the heli and Cessna using the techniques required by real planes. Once the driving controls are better oriented I hope everyone else will feel the same about the ground vehicles.

[zuluknob]

same goes for the aircraft. options for simple controls and simplified physics.

[PRiME]

could make it so when no turning key is pressed and truck is going forward it slowly re-centres. This would be realistic enough for keyboard. Perhaps some options in the menu in slider form to allow people to adjust steering and control speed responses?

[zuluknob]

If you make the overall physics arcady there will be no advantage to using this platform as a sim.

Dood, this is the Anteworld section of the board not the Outerra engine section. Agree that they should go the whole hog with the outerra engine but not the anteworld game.

if players are having to swap controllers all the time to play the game it will get very tiresome. it's one thing to be loading a game then using 1 type of controller while you play that game and another to be swapping every few mins in game. i personally think it would be a pain in the arse to be walking around with mouse/keyboard to get into a car and have to clamp my wheel to my desk drive for a few mins then unclamp the wheel so i can comfortably get to the mouse/keyboard.

given the setting of the game also i would think that the tech of driving/flying would be far easier than it is now. much of the stuff simmers love with attention to detail would be computer controlled. with flight all i need is bank left/right, climb, descend, rudder, throttle, landing gear and some snazzy scanning the environment stuff. driving only needs forward, reverse(lol atm), left and right.

with this new engine type the helicopter will become a thing of the past. http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2011-06/protoype-hovercraft-demonstrates-new-propulsion-system-made-rotating-cylinders

As i have said, this is for anteworld game not the engine as a whole. please put in simplified physics/controls if you want lots and lots of sales.

[cameni]

I'll put the steering and centering speed options into a config file, so you can find the values that are best for you and then we can change the defaults as well. I'm all for making the keyboard controls more accessible, because the keyboard control is always just some approximation.

And unless there are some artificial helpers, using the keyboard is a penalty in itself. There should be a penalty in arcade mode on vehicles where you have additional stabilizers and such things.

[zuluknob]

penalty? err why? using the keyboard and having to tap the keys like mad to get it going round a corner smoothly is enough of a penalty(mouse steering without auto center till your not pressing the modify key/mouse button would be miles better). forcing people by nobbling the keyboard/mouse to go out and buy a wheel/joystick/yoke for a pc game is a bad idea... why would you add more stuff to the sim to make the controls simple? just make a simplified routine you can swap to(says he that can't code). you can remove things from the plane sim and it will fly fine by keyboard. just setting the p-factor to 0 helped so that can be removed for the simple config for a start...

[cameni]

That's what I said, no? "... using the keyboard is a penalty in itself."

[zuluknob]

penalty for additional stabilizers?

[cameni]

What was meant is that regardless of the controls used, flying a plane or helo in arcade mode, which effectively turns off several real factors and helps the player from junking himself immediately, should give a slight disadvantage.

As in, a 1/20th of the engine's power goes into the extra stabilization and guidance systems (as an example).

[zuluknob]

err...why? is that what happens with real helicopter stabilization tech? thought it was a computer calculating and adjusting the fly by wire so it fly's better. a computer can make adjustment far faster than a human so would use less power would it not? same goes for fighters.  in fact most fighters would be unflyable if it wasn't for the computer.

what i am saying only applies to anteworld game. with the outerra engine go the whole hog. if you make a flightsim based on the engine people would be mad to buy it and expect keyboard controls. but a first person re-colonization game where you can use many different vehicle types, most of your customers would be keyboard/mouse based i think. can you imagine playing gta with mouse/keyboard/wheel and joystick? would be a right pain in the arse.

rather than add a autotrim routine to the aircraft remove/ignore the things that make it a pain for keyboard like the p-factor and the nose pitching according to engine power(dunno about the helicopter as it just goes mental right away atm). that can be done in the config files you just need to select which set to use in the game menu.

[mctash]

I can see where Zulu is coming from. Anteworld has sim elements but isn't strictly a sim. I don't think there should be any penalty for players who wish to use "arcady" controls. I think if the option for easy controls isn't there players coming later on (who most likely wont be sim fanatics as we seem to be here already) may get slightly pissed off.

Not everyone who will play Anteworld is a sim fanatic. Some people don't want to spend 10 mins starting up a jet fighter ( like I do )

If an important part of the game is getting around by various vehicles then the vehicles should be universally simple to control.
Having said that, there is no reason to not include the option for realistic controls if players want, but it should be optional and not the default.

Personally I can't wait for a proper vehicle sims using Outerra engine, but I think it may be a little over-eager to try and shoe horn them in to Anteworld.

I don't mean to sound negative just putting in my 2 pence.

[Luishi5k0]

Perhaps cameni means that for the sake of keeping players on a similar level when in multiplayer. I agree I that respect. If I want to take the time to race my stimulator vehicle that I set up versus an arcade player, I'd want an advantage of some form on my side.

[mctash]

I thinkthis issue may be resolved through lots of play testing!