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Author Topic: Version 0.7.16.3782  (Read 90607 times)

cameni

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #120 on: August 05, 2013, 01:49:12 pm »

Before we go debugging it any further, please update your Catalyst drivers - somewhere around the 13.2 version there was a fix for one OpenGL issue that was causing tears on terrain, maybe the detection of whether the drivers have the fix for it is not ok.
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Midviki

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #121 on: August 07, 2013, 02:00:21 pm »

So I have 13.2 version.
And there is 13.4 version.And a 13.8 beta version.

Which one do you want me to install?
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cameni

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #122 on: August 07, 2013, 02:13:49 pm »

You could try 13.4 first, if that doesn't solve the problem, then 13.8 beta
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Midviki

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #123 on: August 07, 2013, 06:20:58 pm »

Neah... I give up! (rofl)  :'(

I uninstalled the whole thing... and now it doesn't appear any driver installed...

But Outerra is still working.. ( probably my intel i3 driver kicked in ).Oh the terror. :)

I will probably just have to postpone this for a few days or till the official 14.x driver comes out in autumn / winter.

Anyway.. even with no driver installed... now it works, no more spikes or freezing in the air.So I am happy for now.And no terrain visual bug as well.

Anyway... I will still check this matter in the future.
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Jagerbomber

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #124 on: August 11, 2013, 10:11:22 pm »

I'm surprised I didn't notice this before, but it's just because of the usual order I click things - If you select an already placed road, delete a waypoint WITHOUT deleting the road, and then click "Make," it gives you an error window that just says "Error" and crashes.  Error report sent.

If someone were to make a modification this way, it should probably erase the deleted waypoints from the road being edited, even if it is still placed.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2013, 10:13:28 pm by Jagerbomber »
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Jagerbomber

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #125 on: August 12, 2013, 06:55:30 pm »

Was something changed recently with road values defaulting or something?  Because I'm noticing some some weird quirks with it now.
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cameni

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #126 on: August 13, 2013, 01:54:18 am »

Nope, nothing changed there recently.
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Midviki

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #127 on: August 13, 2013, 03:57:19 am »

hmmm... for the last week or so.. I started to check up on outerra / anteworld again.

And my feedback on a lot of things is... good and bad... but mostly bad... but hopefully the developers of the engine can learn something out of it.

For me outerra / anteworld, for now, is just a 'recreational activity'.And by that I mean, me as an artist / writer / developer / programmer, for now I use it just to play on it an nothing more.But I have around 7-8 months since I last time used the engine to fly a plane / drive a car or something.And around 1 year and a few months since I started using it and kept a track on things and to notice differences.

Anyway... for now.... the things that I am not pleased with are:

- The vehicles have a lot of s&!t going on... glitches, bugs, errors, lag, frame drop, ... etc. .. you name it!And you know it was my only thing that made me relax most of the time and help my thinking process of what I should try to think of developing next on my future game.It just felt relaxing and made me imagine things with a much more ease.It was something nice... but now most of the things are mildly broke.

- Visual bugs there are many of those, but I will not start going in to that.. some of them might be my computer's or driver's fault and might behave in a different manner to some other users with different graphic cards or drivers.So I'm not going to go in to this now without presenting you some research and documentation.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

- And the third thing, for now, ... is the dramatically decreased of frames per second since last year till now.And I understand that things like increased textures, rocks and other things have a demand for more resources, and it is a good thing from my perspective... but like a year ago or something like that the engine / game had a vision of an efficient resource consumption.
   Anyway... my point being is that... Can't you just go to some of your roots?.. and make the quality of everything a universal thing? ... And by that I mean, to make everything run on the same resource of creation and be a an equal divided quality.
   You see what I am telling you here is more of something like 'reinventing the wheel' and rethinking everything through a new perspective.
   And with all this blabbing I should give some example or something.For example... have you thought of procedurally generating the pixels, the colors, shapes and other things and not have to perceive them as 'physical' entities?I mean... think of it being endless but you only use one thing, like your own screen resolution of 1920x1080 made out of 2.073.600 pixels to be hand made by the developer, each pixel drawn by coding each pixel individually.
   Anyway... that was just a thought of many from my side, and there are many more thoughts like this and what I just said here is not really elaborated with more details, but just like a 'thing' for you to think about it.What I just said on this last 3rd part, maybe seen as insane, but not impossible.



   ( This last part was something more of a personal thing with a much higher level of crazy from my side, but the first 2 are something of more substantial use, so don't take this last part personal, think of it like something a crazy person would tell you, after reading or hearing it you would dismiss it and ignore that thought ever again or keep the thought in a dark far corner of your mind and sometimes contemplate on it. )



Cheers!

- Alex
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necro

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #128 on: August 13, 2013, 04:42:33 am »

As the programmer, who you are, you may not get the idea to have better ideas than the developers. I am pretty sure that outerra is one of the best optimized world engines on this planet.

Actually your post is very offensive, insolent and somewhat rude. You do not know whats going on behind the scenes. All i can read is "i am unsatisfied with the slow process >:O" Thats unfair, isnt it? Get a closer look to the processes before judging them.

And if you believe that your ideas are the holy grail, you are free to implement these ideas in your own engine. I am very curious about that and please show me the result. I want to compare this with OT. And if you did a great job, which i guess because you are programmer, you could make some papers for the siggraph next year.
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PytonPago

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #129 on: August 13, 2013, 05:10:12 am »

Midviki ... i would not take the FPS seriously at this stages. Just because theyr trying still some max. and min. capabilities of OT. When the biomes and weather is there, then the fine tuning will start. You can see too, that all models and vehicles still dont have any LODs, and the HW reserves have to be taken to account only after all basic and crucial stuff are implemented into OT. It may seem slow, but the things they do arent simple at all ( and yes, i would be more worried about the Hlaf-Life EP3 release date  ;D ). So at this time FPS/Quality will be an option-menu limits thing ... but it will be better, when the content is at the needed state.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2013, 05:12:28 am by PytonPago »
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cameni

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #130 on: August 13, 2013, 05:50:55 am »

- The vehicles have a lot of s&!t going on... glitches, bugs, errors, lag, frame drop, ... etc. .. you name it!
Please elaborate what you are referring to here.

Quote
- And the third thing, for now, ... is the dramatically decreased of frames per second since last year till now.And I understand that things like increased textures, rocks and other things have a demand for more resources, and it is a good thing from my perspective... but like a year ago or something like that the engine / game had a vision of an efficient resource consumption.
Hmm, not much changed here, maybe the 3D grass does this for you? But given that your drivers are clearly in a bad shape, you should resolve that first before comparing.
It's disturbingly common with Catalyst - for example see this guy: https://developer.oculusvr.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=1508&start=40#p40921
From 15-20 fps regardless of the settings to 200 fps (though I guess it was at a higher alt) at medium quality just by a clean reinstall of Catalyst?

I think we need to make a benchmark so that the different cards can be easily compared and things like these more easily detected.
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Midviki

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #131 on: August 13, 2013, 10:52:46 am »

- The vehicles have a lot of s&!t going on... glitches, bugs, errors, lag, frame drop, ... etc. .. you name it!
Please elaborate what you are referring to here.

I started a new topic about it, and I will fill it as soon as I get enough screenshots to document it. ( http://www.outerra.com/forum/index.php?topic=2126.0 )

Keep in mind all this started a few days ago when my little nephew showed me that he had a problem and he got stuck driving the truck.So by this I assume that you already knew some of the issues and if not I am glad that I'm telling them to you now.

-----------------------------------

And as for the fps... I do not have a fps problems.. I have around 60 - 100 of them all the time.And many games work without having any trouble.


-----------------------------------

For the "crazy talk theories" that I talked about, I saw that in another engine.And I thought it would be cool to see that in outerra as well.Or something similar to that engine, not to break any patent laws.

-----------------------------------

As the programmer, who you are, you may not get the idea to have better ideas than the developers. I am pretty sure that outerra is one of the best optimized world engines on this planet.

Actually your post is very offensive, insolent and somewhat rude. You do not know whats going on behind the scenes. All i can read is "i am unsatisfied with the slow process >:O" Thats unfair, isnt it? Get a closer look to the processes before judging them.

And if you believe that your ideas are the holy grail, you are free to implement these ideas in your own engine. I am very curious about that and please show me the result. I want to compare this with OT. And if you did a great job, which i guess because you are programmer, you could make some papers for the siggraph next year.

Necro... I will bash you later for that...  ;D  ... and you should know there is already an engine that does specifically what I said in my crazy talk, and regards to 3rd part you should have not taken what I just said so seriously.

-----------------------------------

Midviki ... i would not take the FPS seriously at this stages.

Yep you are 100% right!
Mostly it was just an observation of mine, pointing out that if Cameni and the other devs keep adding things it will take a toll on many computers in the future and they need to have a more efficient system put in place starting from early stages.

Imagine in a city 10.000 players and 2.000 of them are driving cars!Imagine that much simulation....
And I know now if I spawn around 4-5 of those army helicopters I will start having problems... imagine being in a city with 20-150 cars in your line of sight.
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PytonPago

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #132 on: August 13, 2013, 05:31:43 pm »

And I know now if I spawn around 4-5 of those army helicopters I will start having problems... imagine being in a city with 20-150 cars in your line of sight.

... not to mention, they would crash or have some action whyte mil. helis getting the hell fires loose out of their gatlings ... im optimistic, that will be done one day at reasonable measures.  ;D
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Jagerbomber

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #133 on: August 14, 2013, 10:31:19 pm »

Yeah, there seems to be some issue with the road elevation value not being set to the value that the selected waypoint currently has if you select a different road after editing (the elevation?) another road's waypoint, but as far as I can figure out, it seems to only be with the start/end points and the one before/after it I think?
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jimbalny

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Re: Latest version 0.7.16.3782
« Reply #134 on: August 22, 2013, 10:00:16 pm »

Yep you are 100% right!
Mostly it was just an observation of mine, pointing out that if Cameni and the other devs keep adding things it will take a toll on many computers in the future and they need to have a more efficient system put in place starting from early stages.

Isn't it fair to say that computers in the future will be much better equipped to handle anything added to the game?  ;)

As with any game in an alpha state, things will get worse before they get better. Especially building a new engine from scratch when big teams of people could take years to complete. It just wouldn't make sense in my mind to focus more time, say, optimizing the swaying of grass before moving on to more features when it all may have to be changed or scrapped further down in the process anyway. Does an artist focus most of his/her efforts on a sketch or the finishing details of a painting? I've alpha and beta tested a lot of games, but then again I'm no programmer so what do I know :-X

Only bug report I have thus far is that my trees look flat and cardboardy :o
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